[brydeemer]

Our coverage of JSA starts here!

Bry

[Big Jim]

I'm really looking forward to this...

[Peter]

I couldn't think of it at the time, but the Morrison/JLA story that featured the JSA before their series was titled Crisis Times Five.
http://comicbookdb.com/issue.php?ID=14268

[Hong Kong Cavalier]

I couldn't think of it at the time, but the Morrison/JLA story that featured the JSA before their series was titled Crisis Times Five.
http://comicbookdb.com/issue.php?ID=14268

I'm a long-time JSA fan, starting my obsession with the team by actually subscribing to All-Star Squadron, Young All-Stars, and Infinity, Inc., in my youth....

Something that I find really interesting is that at one time in the early 1990s, during the dawn of the Vertigo imprint while Matt Wagner's work on Sandman Mystery Theatre was starting to take off and James Robinson's Starman was starting to find it's audience, I remember a sidebar blurb in an old issue of Starlog Communications Comic Scene magazine in which they told of a pitch that Wagner and Robinson had been throwing around (that obviously never got past the pitch stage) for a Vertigo Justice Society book, in which they'd take a more mature and slightly "realistic" (and I use this term loosely, seeing as how we're talking about comics) look at the JSA's war-time activities, much in the vein of Mystery Theatre. I've always wondered how that woulda panned out...though I think we got a taste of it in some of Robinson's "Times Past" stories...

[Simon]

Our coverage of JSA starts here!

Bry

Wesley Dodds is the man! I'm a huge fan of the original Sandman. I won a Mike Norton sketch of Dodds in his gas masked magnificence at the super show. I'd post a link to it on comicsketchgallery.com but it seems to be down right now.

As to your question about where Sandman got his prophetic dreaming powers. To the best of my knowledge he did not have them during his original run in Adventure Comics (1940's). It was retconed in during a Neil Gaiman/Matt Wagner written Sandman Mystery Theater where Wesley Dodds meets Dream. Apparently Wesley holds an aspect of Dream which has been passed on to Sandy Hawkins, the current Sandman. In many issues of Sandman Mystery Theater, Wesley mentions that the dreams drive him to bring criminals to judgment.

Great episode, I'm so looking forward to an issue by issue review of JSA which is one of my favorite series of all time.

Simon

[Simon]

Wesley Dodds is the man! I'm a huge fan of the original Sandman. I won a Mike Norton sketch of Dodds in his gas masked magnificence at the super show. I'd post a link to it on comicsketchgallery.com but it seems to be down right now.

As to your question about where Sandman got his prophetic dreaming powers. To the best of my knowledge he did not have them during his original run in Adventure Comics (1940's). It was retconed in during a Neil Gaiman/Matt Wagner written Sandman Mystery Theater where Wesley Dodds meets Dream. Apparently Wesley holds an aspect of Dream which has been passed on to Sandy Hawkins, the current Sandman. In many issues of Sandman Mystery Theater, Wesley mentions that the dreams drive him to bring criminals to judgment.

Great episode, I'm so looking forward to an issue by issue review of JSA which is one of my favorite series of all time.

Simon

Found the new url:

http://gallery.comicgeekspeak.com/sketches/sketch/5311

[rebis]

Fun ep! Brings back many good memories.

A few random thoughts on JSA.

I don't think that the promise of the Kendra Saunders character has ever been realized. At the beginning, Kendra wasn't a "nice" person. She brought a lot of emotional baggage to the team. Not to mention all the stories that could have come about once her "successful" suicide and possession/reincarnation by the soul of Shiera Hall was revealed. I also loved that her body type was so different from what comic book heroines have traditionally been. At the time she really broke that bubble breasted steriotype. To bad Chaykin slammed her bad into that mold. I think DC has dropped the ball with her.

Love that design for Black Canary. I really miss that look. I wish that when Green Arrow was brought back, DC didn't feel it necessary to automatically pair Canary with GA.

I miss Jack Knight, but I would rather he be left alone then brought into a series just because fans miss him.

[Peter]

I'm a long-time JSA fan, starting my obsession with the team by actually subscribing to All-Star Squadron, Young All-Stars, and Infinity, Inc., in my youth....

Something that I find really interesting is that at one time in the early 1990s, during the dawn of the Vertigo imprint while Matt Wagner's work on Sandman Mystery Theatre was starting to take off and James Robinson's Starman was starting to find it's audience, I remember a sidebar blurb in an old issue of Starlog Communications Comic Scene magazine in which they told of a pitch that Wagner and Robinson had been throwing around (that obviously never got past the pitch stage) for a Vertigo Justice Society book, in which they'd take a more mature and slightly "realistic" (and I use this term loosely, seeing as how we're talking about comics) look at the JSA's war-time activities, much in the vein of Mystery Theatre. I've always wondered how that woulda panned out...though I think we got a taste of it in some of Robinson's "Times Past" stories...

Now that the current JSA series is so popular, maybe having a second book on the Golden Age might be overkill. But if they were to do it and focus on other non-JSA characters it could be awesome. Maybe the next DC weekly should be called the Golden Age and look at the development of that era or a riff on All-Star Squadron but with today's approach (in terms of writing/art, etc). I'd love to read something like that.

And man - Young All Stars was so good for awhile.

[Peter]

Wesley Dodds is the man! I'm a huge fan of the original Sandman. I won a Mike Norton sketch of Dodds in his gas masked magnificence at the super show. I'd post a link to it on comicsketchgallery.com but it seems to be down right now.

As to your question about where Sandman got his prophetic dreaming powers. To the best of my knowledge he did not have them during his original run in Adventure Comics (1940's). It was retconed in during a Neil Gaiman/Matt Wagner written Sandman Mystery Theater where Wesley Dodds meets Dream. Apparently Wesley holds an aspect of Dream which has been passed on to Sandy Hawkins, the current Sandman. In many issues of Sandman Mystery Theater, Wesley mentions that the dreams drive him to bring criminals to judgment.

Great episode, I'm so looking forward to an issue by issue review of JSA which is one of my favorite series of all time.

Simon

Is that the Sandman Midnight Theatre oneshot?
http://www.comicbookdb.com/issue.php?ID=28447

[Peter]

Fun ep! Brings back many good memories.

A few random thoughts on JSA.

I don't think that the promise of the Kendra Saunders character has ever been realized. At the beginning, Kendra wasn't a "nice" person. She brought a lot of emotional baggage to the team. Not to mention all the stories that could have come about once her "successful" suicide and possession/reincarnation by the soul of Shiera Hall was revealed. I also loved that her body type was so different from what comic book heroines have traditionally been. At the time she really broke that bubble breasted steriotype. To bad Chaykin slammed her bad into that mold. I think DC has dropped the ball with her.

Love that design for Black Canary. I really miss that look. I wish that when Green Arrow was brought back, DC didn't feel it necessary to automatically pair Canary with GA.

I miss Jack Knight, but I would rather he be left alone then brought into a series just because fans miss him.

Kendra took a step back during the Chaykin run for sure. I thought maybe her appearances in JLA would boost her as a character but it's not really working. I think there's more stories to tell with her if they get her in the right environment.

And it is interesting to see how Jack Knight - who should be one of the stars of JSA - turns out to be more of a sidelined character. Which does go with his personality, so it's not too much of a surprise.

[Hong Kong Cavalier]

I laughed out loud at Jamie recounting his reaction to Wesley Dodds' demise, for I had a similar one myself. I had another recently when I saw what Morrison did with the Greg Sanders Vigilante in Seven Soldiers...I'm a hardcore Golden Age Vigilante fan. While James Robinson is on everyone's minds because of this podcast, I'd like to highly recommend the under-appreciated 4 issue Vigilante: City Lights, Prairie Justice mini-series Robinson wrote around the time Starman was really starting to get good word of mouth critically...

I'm sooooo glad that DC has finally decided to trade this mini....details here.

[ctowner1]

So are these complete spoiler eps? I'm in the process of reading the original Johns series (1/2 way through). Would it be best for me to wait until I've completed that before listening? And beyond that, I'm WFTT on the current series (which has been super slow) - will you be talking about stuff that hasn't been traded yet?

e
L nny

[ctowner1]

Is that the Sandman Midnight Theatre oneshot?
http://www.comicbookdb.com/issue.php?ID=28447

IIRC, Wesley had the prophetic dreams from the onset of Wagner's Sandman Mystery Theatre (a series that I LOVE). The Sandman Midnight Theatre one shot issue came later and was just simply a story which included Dream. I don't think it explained his dreams (but I could be wrong).

e
L nny

This post has been edited by ctowner1: 21 November 2008 - 07:03 PM

[ctowner1]

I'm a long-time JSA fan, starting my obsession with the team by actually subscribing to All-Star Squadron, Young All-Stars, and Infinity, Inc., in my youth....

Something that I find really interesting is that at one time in the early 1990s, during the dawn of the Vertigo imprint while Matt Wagner's work on Sandman Mystery Theatre was starting to take off and James Robinson's Starman was starting to find it's audience, I remember a sidebar blurb in an old issue of Starlog Communications Comic Scene magazine in which they told of a pitch that Wagner and Robinson had been throwing around (that obviously never got past the pitch stage) for a Vertigo Justice Society book, in which they'd take a more mature and slightly "realistic" (and I use this term loosely, seeing as how we're talking about comics) look at the JSA's war-time activities, much in the vein of Mystery Theatre. I've always wondered how that woulda panned out...though I think we got a taste of it in some of Robinson's "Times Past" stories...

I remember he used Hourman in SMT. I forget - were any ther JSAers used as well? Seems to me there might have been some others?

e
L nny

[Peter]

I laughed out loud at Jamie recounting his reaction to Wesley Dodds' demise, for I had a similar one myself. I had another recently when I saw what Morrison did with the Greg Sanders Vigilante in Seven Soldiers...I'm a hardcore Golden Age Vigilante fan. While James Robinson is on everyone's minds because of this podcast, I'd like to highly recommend the under-appreciated 4 issue Vigilante: City Lights, Prairie Justice mini-series Robinson wrote around the time Starman was really starting to get good word of mouth critically...

I'm sooooo glad that DC has finally decided to trade this mini....details here.

Vigilante is a fun mini-series. I see it often in the backissue bins at conventions. To bring it full circle, I sold my Vigilante mini-series on ebay a few years back to a guy in California named James Robinson! Crazy right? Guess maybe he needed the issues. lol

[Peter]

So are these complete spoiler eps? I'm in the process of reading the original Johns series (1/2 way through). Would it be best for me to wait until I've completed that before listening? And beyond that, I'm WFTT on the current series (which has been super slow) - will you be talking about stuff that hasn't been traded yet?

e
L nny

These Footnotes will obviously spoil the issue we're talking about - but we're also allowing ourselves to be open on spoilers for future issues down the road in the same series. That's part of the Footnotes process - spotlighting foreshadowing, early hints, etc. I can't say what will come up in terms of the recent series. For one, I'm way behind on it. Two, these are meant to be open discussions on the series we're focusing on without holding back, but the current series might be off limits. However, if I feel it needs to be talked about because it's important to the first JSA series, then I will talk about it. Can't be thorough otherwise.

[Peter]

IIRC, Wesley had the prophetic dreams from the onset of Wagner's Sandman Mystery Theatre (a series that I LOVE). The Sandman Midnight Theatre one shot issue came later and was just simply a story which included Dream. I don't think it explained his dreams (but I could be wrong).

e
L nny

Cool. Sandman Mystery Theatre predates Kingdom Come. So that answers that question. But now I want to know if it came up during the Gaiman Sandman series at all? Or even before that. Need to break out my Who's Who.

[ctowner1]

These Footnotes will obviously spoil the issue we're talking about - but we're also allowing ourselves to be open on spoilers for future issues down the road in the same series. That's part of the Footnotes process - spotlighting foreshadowing, early hints, etc. I can't say what will come up in terms of the recent series. For one, I'm way behind on it. Two, these are meant to be open discussions on the series we're focusing on without holding back, but the current series might be off limits. However, if I feel it needs to be talked about because it's important to the first JSA series, then I will talk about it. Can't be thorough otherwise.

fair enough. thanks for the clarification, Peter!

e
L nny

[ctowner1]

Cool. Sandman Mystery Theatre predates Kingdom Come. So that answers that question. But now I want to know if it came up during the Gaiman Sandman series at all? Or even before that. Need to break out my Who's Who.

Gaiman definitely dealt with the prior Sandman (Sandmen?) in the (IIRC) 2nd arc of the series. It's been a long time since I read it (and hopefully one day soon I'll reread it in the Absolute Sandman vol. 1 that's been on my bookshelf unread for well over a year now! lol). I think it may have focussed on Sandy, not Wesley though. I recall they had Lyta Hall in it as well - and that was all greek to me b/c I didn't know who she was (DC's always been my "second language", but have since read Infinity, Inc. and some JSA - so I'm, a bit more up on it).

ADDENDUM: oh..I just looked it up - SMT came AFTER those Sandman issues - so if Gaiman dealt with Wesley at all, it wouldn't be the Wesley that was developed in the later SMT issues.

e
L nny

This post has been edited by ctowner1: 21 November 2008 - 07:35 PM

[Bibliomike]

Ok, so I want to play along but am not familiar with JSA and don't know what trades (if any) I can get to jump in. I also don't want to listen to the episode yet for fear of spoilers! So could someone please provide a handy-dandy checklist? Thanks much!

BTW, I am 1/4 of the way through JLA/Avengers and am loving it, far more than I expected I would (not being a big Marvelite -- or, really, much of a Marvelite at all). So I will be ready soon to play catch-up with the "Footnotes, Vol. 1" as it were. :-) I also got a complete run of Secret Wars off eBay today (again, amazing, considering I am not a Marvelite -- but I do realize it's the first significant comics Event, so that alone makes it worth having) -- so plenty of Footnotes fun to be had! You guys just better do something I already own soon to give my wallet a breather. ;-)